Discussion:
Obscurities What If
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Bill B
2019-05-02 20:59:24 UTC
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What if the preliminary round only votes for fourth place records? This way, the other participants don't know what everyone else is thinking and clear favorites would not be ascertainable until the actual tournament. It would increase the chances of a tie, but tied records could run one against the other for a quick decision. Just thinking, not advocating.
DianeE
2019-05-02 21:12:21 UTC
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Post by Bill B
What if the preliminary round only votes for fourth place records? This way, the other participants don't know what everyone else is thinking and clear favorites would not be ascertainable until the actual tournament. It would increase the chances of a tie, but tied records could run one against the other for a quick decision. Just thinking, not advocating.
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Wait, you're proposing we only vote on which records to eliminate?
Bill B
2019-05-02 21:17:20 UTC
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In the preliminary round. That's the purpose of the round.
DianeE
2019-05-03 01:00:36 UTC
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Post by Bill B
In the preliminary round. That's the purpose of the round.
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I can't see anything wrong with your idea; now I'm waiting for Bruce to
explain what's wrong with it.
SavoyBG
2019-05-03 02:36:28 UTC
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Post by DianeE
Post by Bill B
In the preliminary round. That's the purpose of the round.
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I can't see anything wrong with your idea; now I'm waiting for Bruce to
explain what's wrong with it.
Don't hold your breath!
DianeE
2019-05-03 04:06:14 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Post by DianeE
Post by Bill B
In the preliminary round. That's the purpose of the round.
----------
I can't see anything wrong with your idea; now I'm waiting for Bruce to
explain what's wrong with it.
Don't hold your breath!
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What's wrong with his idea? Why bother ranking 4 if the whole point is
to eliminate 1? Just vote for the one you'd like to eliminate. (As he
said, only in the prelims.)
SavoyBG
2019-05-03 06:24:04 UTC
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Post by DianeE
Post by SavoyBG
Post by DianeE
Post by Bill B
In the preliminary round. That's the purpose of the round.
----------
I can't see anything wrong with your idea; now I'm waiting for Bruce to
explain what's wrong with it.
Don't hold your breath!
-------------
What's wrong with his idea? Why bother ranking 4 if the whole point is
to eliminate 1? Just vote for the one you'd like to eliminate. (As he
said, only in the prelims.)
A - The ties. There will be lots of them. Suppose there are 12 voters and all 4 records get 3 votes each as the worst record? Suppose 3 records get 4 votes each as the worst record? Suppose 2 records get 6 votes each as the worst record. None of those ties can be broken by a head to head contest as Bill proposed. And I don't want to have to break ties with another vote.

B - We eliminate one from each group plus the lowest scoring 3rd place record from any of the groups. How does that work with Bill's proposal. What happens when 5 third place records all tie with 3 votes each as the worst record in their group. Another revote with just those 5, and then another tie when 4 of them get 3 votes each as the new worst record?

C - The song with the most last place votes is not always the worst song. For instance, in Group 10 of April's prelims "Starlight Starbright" by Luther Bond and the Emeralds finished last with 24 point but it only had 3 last place votes. "All My Love Belongs To You" by the Hearts finished 3rd with 25 points, but it had 6 last place votes, but was listed first or second on the other 6 ballots. Same thing in Group 5 where "Boogie Woogie Choo Choo Train" by Mabel Scott had the lowest point total with 24 but "Never Knew" by the Midnighters had the most last place votes with 5.

That's why we rank them 1 through 4 rather than just voting for the best or worst song, because it's a far more accurate way of assessing the group's overall rating of each record.

I see nothing wrong with favorites being established in the Prelims, although that has not been what has happened in the past tournaments. The record that won the April Tournament (Rich Woman) only finished second in its prelim, losing by 3 points to a record (Slow Down) that did not even end up making the finals.

The rules are fine the way they are.
DianeE
2019-05-03 11:36:20 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Post by DianeE
Post by SavoyBG
Post by DianeE
Post by Bill B
In the preliminary round. That's the purpose of the round.
----------
I can't see anything wrong with your idea; now I'm waiting for Bruce to
explain what's wrong with it.
Don't hold your breath!
-------------
What's wrong with his idea? Why bother ranking 4 if the whole point is
to eliminate 1? Just vote for the one you'd like to eliminate. (As he
said, only in the prelims.)
A - The ties. There will be lots of them. Suppose there are 12 voters and all 4 records get 3 votes each as the worst record? Suppose 3 records get 4 votes each as the worst record? Suppose 2 records get 6 votes each as the worst record. None of those ties can be broken by a head to head contest as Bill proposed. And I don't want to have to break ties with another vote.
B - We eliminate one from each group plus the lowest scoring 3rd place record from any of the groups. How does that work with Bill's proposal. What happens when 5 third place records all tie with 3 votes each as the worst record in their group. Another revote with just those 5, and then another tie when 4 of them get 3 votes each as the new worst record?
C - The song with the most last place votes is not always the worst song. For instance, in Group 10 of April's prelims "Starlight Starbright" by Luther Bond and the Emeralds finished last with 24 point but it only had 3 last place votes. "All My Love Belongs To You" by the Hearts finished 3rd with 25 points, but it had 6 last place votes, but was listed first or second on the other 6 ballots. Same thing in Group 5 where "Boogie Woogie Choo Choo Train" by Mabel Scott had the lowest point total with 24 but "Never Knew" by the Midnighters had the most last place votes with 5.
That's why we rank them 1 through 4 rather than just voting for the best or worst song, because it's a far more accurate way of assessing the group's overall rating of each record.
I see nothing wrong with favorites being established in the Prelims, although that has not been what has happened in the past tournaments. The record that won the April Tournament (Rich Woman) only finished second in its prelim, losing by 3 points to a record (Slow Down) that did not even end up making the finals.
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Okay, good answer.
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Post by SavoyBG
The rules are fine the way they are.
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Yes, but it's always good to be open to the possibility that there might
be a better way of doing things.
Roger Ford
2019-05-03 11:40:50 UTC
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Post by DianeE
Post by SavoyBG
The rules are fine the way they are.
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Yes, but it's always good to be open to the possibility that there might
be a better way of doing things.
I wish you'd come over and explain that to my girlfriend when we wake
in the middle of the night

ROGER FORD
-----------------------

"Spam Free Zone" - to combat unwanted automatic spamming I have added
an extra "b" in my e-mail address (***@bblueyonder.co.uk) Please
delete same before responding.Thank you!
SavoyBG
2019-05-03 14:39:45 UTC
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Post by Roger Ford
Post by DianeE
Post by SavoyBG
The rules are fine the way they are.
----------
Yes, but it's always good to be open to the possibility that there might
be a better way of doing things.
I wish you'd come over and explain that to my girlfriend when we wake
in the middle of the night
What, you can't get her to try any new positions?
Dennis C
2019-05-03 14:43:00 UTC
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Turn her around and do the Brexit, baby!!!
Roger Ford
2019-05-03 16:16:28 UTC
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Post by Dennis C
Turn her around and do the Brexit, baby!!!
Looks like nobody here can do fucking Brexit :-(

ROGER FORD
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"Spam Free Zone" - to combat unwanted automatic spamming I have added
an extra "b" in my e-mail address (***@bblueyonder.co.uk) Please
delete same before responding.Thank you!

Roger Ford
2019-05-03 16:15:18 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Post by Roger Ford
Post by DianeE
Post by SavoyBG
The rules are fine the way they are.
----------
Yes, but it's always good to be open to the possibility that there might
be a better way of doing things.
I wish you'd come over and explain that to my girlfriend when we wake
in the middle of the night
What, you can't get her to try any new positions?
LOL!



ROGER FORD
-----------------------

"Spam Free Zone" - to combat unwanted automatic spamming I have added
an extra "b" in my e-mail address (***@bblueyonder.co.uk) Please
delete same before responding.Thank you!
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