Discussion:
Obscure 1950s Era Recordings - March - Preliminary Round - Group 5
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SavoyBG
2020-03-06 14:57:56 UTC
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Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.


Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight


Since I First Met You - Robins


I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders


Slow Down - Jack Earls


Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes

SavoyBG
2020-03-06 14:58:26 UTC
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MY RANKINGS


1. Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight
2. Slow Down - Jack Earls
3. I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders
4. Since I First Met You - Robins
5. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
Carl
2020-03-06 15:21:10 UTC
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1. Since I First Met You - Robins
2. Slow Down - Jack Earls
3. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
4. I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders
5. Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight
Steve Mc
2020-03-06 15:38:45 UTC
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1. Slow Down - Jack Earls

2. Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight

3. I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders

4. Since I First Met You - Robins

5. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
--
Steve Mc

DNA to SBC to respond
RWC
2020-03-06 19:14:13 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
MY RANKINGS
5. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
Bruce, it's a crime to have no emotional feeling for the music.
Dennis C
2020-03-06 19:59:43 UTC
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Bruce robotically, spasmodically, and soullessly knee-jerks to Big Joe Turner reiterations, baby!!

Emotion? What dat?
SavoyBG
2020-03-06 20:08:09 UTC
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Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
MY RANKINGS
5. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
Bruce, it's a crime to have no emotional feeling for the music.
Yes, I agree. For me, sophisticated = lack of emotion.
Roger Ford
2020-03-06 15:03:04 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight - 8
Slow Down - Jack Earls - 8
I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders - 8
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes - 7
Since I First Met You - Robins - 6




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Roger Ford
2020-03-06 15:10:55 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight
http://youtu.be/os2p5li7K5I
This guy was Ike Turner's nephew Jesse (note no "i") and sometime bass
player with his band.This great little 1954 number (that owes just a
teeny weeny tad to "Shake Rattle And Roll") was one of the last field
recordings by Chess--taking place down in Clarksdale Mississippi. That
particular trip also resulted in another Turner project getting
released by Checker---the horror-comedy "Sinner's Dream" monologue
credited to the unfortunate hell-bound Eugene Fox,another Ike bandmate


Most of the then-current Turner band back Knight here---the
aforementioned Fox and Raymond Fields (ten saxes),Dennis "Long Man"
Binder (pno) Ike Turner (gtr) and Willie Sims (dms). The flipside
"Nobody Seems To Want Me" is credited to Knight too but its actually
Ike himself doing the warbling here . "Contractual difficulties" got
in the way of him being artist credited. Well,that was his story and
he's sticking to it
Post by SavoyBG
Since I First Met You - Robins
http://youtu.be/4V36lCavw1U
I'm not a huge fan of the deconstructed Robins and their Whippet sides
but this 1957 one is passable even with the glaring loss of Gardner
and Nunn.But--just like with their other Whippet singles---sales were
very moderate. Meantime the missing Mr G and Mr N were proving the
doubters wrong---and were riding high at this time in the R&B chart
with "One Kiss Leads To Another" .

At the start of the hit filled career of The Coasters
Post by SavoyBG
I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders
http://youtu.be/f0v9DU5P6j8
This is an all time favourite uptempo doowop from this New Jersey
group and I can't believe it got missed in the Singles Battles. I also
can't believe that nobody else picked up on it. It should have figured
in 1957 where it was first released on Chock Full Of Hits with MGM
picking it up for national distribution in 1958. After the usual spell
of label hopping (with little sales to show for it) The Serenaders
finally wound up at Motown of all places with "I'll Cry Tomorrow" on
V.I.P in 1964---and finally made it to a Singles Battle!
Post by SavoyBG
Slow Down - Jack Earls
http://youtu.be/4ApBHsvnXOE
This Sun label rockabilly classic was a serious omission from the 1956
Singles Battle so hopefully some restitution can be made here with
Jack (and his Jimbos) going most of the distance. That is,until it
meets my best performing nomination of course....:)
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
The original "Shorty's Got To Go" was in 1946 by Lucky Millinder (who
penned the song) . It was a moderate hit spawning covers by Ace Harris
and The Cats And The Fiddle. This quite decent Bill Johnson & co
version was a little late to the party in May 1947. But the saga
doesn't end there---there was a pop version by Johnny Long Orchestra
in 1950 then the (Mayfield-less) Impressions had a version in 1959.
And round about the same time there was a bluesy version from
trumpeter Jimmy Sedlar.

ROGER FORD
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DianeE
2020-03-06 22:26:06 UTC
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Post by Roger Ford
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
The original "Shorty's Got To Go" was in 1946 by Lucky Millinder (who
penned the song) . It was a moderate hit spawning covers by Ace Harris
and The Cats And The Fiddle. This quite decent Bill Johnson & co
version was a little late to the party in May 1947. But the saga
doesn't end there---there was a pop version by Johnny Long Orchestra
in 1950 then the (Mayfield-less) Impressions had a version in 1959.
And round about the same time there was a bluesy version from
trumpeter Jimmy Sedlar.
---------------
BTW there's a very good article on the story of Bill Johnson & His
Musical Notes at Marv Goldberg's website uncamarvy.com.
Mark Dintenfass
2020-03-06 15:48:55 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders
Slow Down - Jack Earls
Since I First Met You - Robins
Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight
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DianeE
2020-03-06 17:39:46 UTC
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The hiatus is over; this is a very strong group AFAIC.

1-Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes

2-Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight

3-Since I First Met You - Robins

4-Slow Down - Jack Earls

5-I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders
Jim Colegrove
2020-03-06 17:40:38 UTC
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1. Slow Down - Jack Earls

2. Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight

3. I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders

4. Since I First Met You - Robins

5. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
Dennis C
2020-03-06 18:40:44 UTC
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1- Bill Johnson and his Musical Notes

2- Serenaders

3- Robins

4- Jack Earls

5- Jessie Knight( Shake, Rattle, and Ripoff)
RWC
2020-03-06 18:44:00 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact than the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Mark Dintenfass
2020-03-06 19:03:44 UTC
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Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact than the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
--
--md
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SavoyBG
2020-03-06 19:08:42 UTC
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Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact than the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
Sophisticated = not good.
Mark Dintenfass
2020-03-06 23:04:16 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact than the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
Sophisticated = not good.
A sophisticated musician is somehow who has talent, knows his craft
well, and practices it with professionalism. If I called you a
sophisticated umpire would you be insulted?
--
--md
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SavoyBG
2020-03-07 00:38:32 UTC
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Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact than the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
Sophisticated = not good.
A sophisticated musician is somehow who has talent, knows his craft
well, and practices it with professionalism. If I called you a
sophisticated umpire would you be insulted?
I see these definitions of sophisticated.

1. having, revealing, or proceeding from a great deal of worldly experience and knowledge of fashion and culture.

2.
(of a machine, system, or technique) developed to a high degree of complexity.

For me, a sophisticated musician is someone who can play by the book, probably read music, but is lacking the emotion and feel of the cutting edge stuff of the day. Mitch Miller was a sophisticated musician. Rosco Gordon was not a sophisticated musician. I know which one of those two I would rather listen to.
Dennis C
2020-03-07 03:31:22 UTC
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Yeah, you are definitely a sophisticated blind umpire, baby!!
Mark Dintenfass
2020-03-07 04:24:29 UTC
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Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact
than
the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
Sophisticated = not good.
A sophisticated musician is somehow who has talent, knows his craft
well, and practices it with professionalism. If I called you a
sophisticated umpire would you be insulted?
I see these definitions of sophisticated.
1. having, revealing, or proceeding from a great deal of worldly experience
and knowledge of fashion and culture.
2.
(of a machine, system, or technique) developed to a high degree of complexity.
For me, a sophisticated musician is someone who can play by the book,
probably read music, but is lacking the emotion and feel of the cutting edge
stuff of the day. Mitch Miller was a sophisticated musician. Rosco Gordon was
not a sophisticated musician. I know which one of those two I would rather listen to.
Nothing in any good definition of "sophisticated" mentions lack of
emotion. For me, sophisticated means having the skill and to express
yourself in an interesting way. Ray Charles was a sophisticated
musician and Billie Holiday was a incredibly sophisticated singer.
--
--md
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SavoyBG
2020-03-07 04:31:41 UTC
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Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by RWC
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact
than
the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
Sophisticated = not good.
A sophisticated musician is somehow who has talent, knows his craft
well, and practices it with professionalism. If I called you a
sophisticated umpire would you be insulted?
I see these definitions of sophisticated.
1. having, revealing, or proceeding from a great deal of worldly experience
and knowledge of fashion and culture.
2.
(of a machine, system, or technique) developed to a high degree of complexity.
For me, a sophisticated musician is someone who can play by the book,
probably read music, but is lacking the emotion and feel of the cutting edge
stuff of the day. Mitch Miller was a sophisticated musician. Rosco Gordon was
not a sophisticated musician. I know which one of those two I would rather listen to.
Nothing in any good definition of "sophisticated" mentions lack of
emotion. For me, sophisticated means having the skill and to express
yourself in an interesting way. Ray Charles was a sophisticated
musician and Billie Holiday was a incredibly sophisticated singer.
having, revealing, or proceeding from a great deal of worldly experience
and knowledge of fashion and culture.

Nothing in the definition about having skill. Billie was not a sophisticated singer. She had no formal training and did it all from the heart and the gut, which is the total opposite of sophistication.
Bill B
2020-03-07 11:25:31 UTC
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In article <>,
Post by SavoyBG
In article <>,
Post by SavoyBG
Post by Mark Dintenfass
On Fri, 6 Mar 2020 06:57:56 -0800 (PST), SavoyBG <>
Post by SavoyBG
Group 5 is now open. Please rank these from best to worst.
This relatively sophisticated recording also has more lasting impact
than
the
Post by SavoyBG
Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes
http://youtu.be/1KwfvP4wHwc
Geoff
Too bad you're not voting. Sophisticated is a good word for the
singing here.
Sophisticated = not good.
A sophisticated musician is somehow who has talent, knows his craft
well, and practices it with professionalism. If I called you a
sophisticated umpire would you be insulted?
I see these definitions of sophisticated.
1. having, revealing, or proceeding from a great deal of worldly experience
and knowledge of fashion and culture.
2.
(of a machine, system, or technique) developed to a high degree of complexity.
For me, a sophisticated musician is someone who can play by the book,
probably read music, but is lacking the emotion and feel of the cutting edge
stuff of the day. Mitch Miller was a sophisticated musician. Rosco Gordon was
not a sophisticated musician. I know which one of those two I would rather listen to.
Nothing in any good definition of "sophisticated" mentions lack of
emotion. For me, sophisticated means having the skill and to express
yourself in an interesting way. Ray Charles was a sophisticated
musician and Billie Holiday was a incredibly sophisticated singer.
Perhaps the definition of unsophisticated will shed some light on the question:

adjective
adjective: unsophisticated
lacking refined worldly knowledge or tastes.
h
Similar:
unworldly


naive


simple


innocent


ignorant


green


immature


callow


inexperienced


childlike


artless


guileless


ingenuous


down-to-earth


natural


unaffected


unassuming


unpretentious


modest


without airs

unrefined


unpolished


gauche


provincial


parochial


rustic


h
Opposite:
sophisticated


worldly

not complicated or highly developed; basic.
"unsophisticated computer software"
h
Similar:
simple


crude


unrefined


basic


rudimentary


primitive


rough and ready


rough-hewn


make-do


cobbled together

undeveloped


homespun


straightforward


uncomplicated


uninvolved


unspecialized


rude


h
Opposite:
sophisticated


complex

not artificial.
"the village has remained unspoiled and unsophisticated"
Mark Dintenfass
2020-03-07 13:55:26 UTC
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I think you proved that when it comes to music the word can mean
whatever you want it to mean, and that, as usual, definitional
arguments are pointless.

My point is that being self-taught, like most r&b artists and lots of
others, doesn't mean that you haven't mastered the intricacies of your
craft. By itself, merely singing from the heart, or singing your heart
out, doesn't generally make for good music.
--
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SavoyBG
2020-03-06 19:06:44 UTC
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FINAL RANKINGS


1. Slow Down - Jack Earls - 30
2. Nothing But Money - Jessie Knight - 28
3. I Wrote A Letter - Serenaders - 27
4. Since I First Met You - Robins - 25 (5-4)

5. Shorty's Got To Go - Bill Johnson & His Musical Notes - 25

Steve's Sun rocker takes the group with Rogers R&B burner second. My Serenaders a solid third. Rick's Robins edges Mark's BJ in a 5-4 tie breaker for the final spot to advance.
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